Valve Springs replacement

[Steve Wood]

Pretty sure I just said 7 drugs should be fine

[Scoobum]

Quote from: Steve Wood on November 09 2021, 05:52:10 PMI would use new matching retainers and locks if I did it to make sure everything fit just right.

Steel Retainers:728-16  /   750-16
Tool Steel Retainers:1750-16WOW, I can't believe the price for both of these items
Is it possible to still use the existing retainers?

Which is cheaper. New locks and retainers, or dropping a valve.

[ULYCYC]

Why did you remove the intake to replace valve springs???  But since you did I would remove the heads and send them out for a machine shop to go over. Get a mild  competition  valve job with a little bowl work. Should be about $300 plus parts. After all these years I bet the head gaskets are long overdue for replacement.

[Steve Wood]

I wondered the same. That's a good idea. Get them rebuilt.  Might need some valve guide work.

[nocooler]

Well, this snowballed. If it was my car I'd change the seals/springs and send it. 

[Steve Wood]

Julio has been planning this since at least 2013 as I found posts from that period elsewhere when I was verifying something.  I'm not sure why he pulled the intake but at this point, all the work is done except for pulling the bolts out of the headers and out of the heads

[Scoobum]

Well, this snowballed. If it was my car I'd change the seals/springs and send it. 

Agreed. If the compression is even on all cylinders and there's no oil consumption, throw the seals and springs on it and get out there and beat on it like a seal pup.

[ULYCYC]

After 34 yrs everything is worn and needs to be looked so were do you start. Personally I would do nothing and enjoy the car. If you do race the car or beat on it in the street then based the money available I would R&R whats really needed first.

[gnonyx]

Quote from: Steve Wood on November 09 2021, 05:52:10 PMI would use new matching retainers and locks if I did it to make sure everything fit just right.

Steel Retainers:728-16  /   750-16
Tool Steel Retainers:1750-16WOW, I can't believe the price for both of these items
Is it possible to still use the existing retainers?

Which is cheaper. New locks and retainers, or dropping a valve.

I defiantly do greed with the new locks and retainers

[gnonyx]

Julio has been planning this since at least 2013 as I found posts from that period elsewhere when I was verifying something.  I'm not sure why he pulled the intake but at this point, all the work is done except for pulling the bolts out of the headers and out of the heads

Good memory Steve, and age is just a number, as you have proved that many times over. YOU MY MAN

Every time I wanted to put the GN on the road something comes up and for the most part I decided to do many projects, and remodel work around the house.
Now that majority of the projects work is done I can now focus on what I need to do the maintenance the GN needs.
The following are the replacement:
repaired and welded cracked headers, installed factory style
removed and blocked off EGR
replaced ignition module and coli pack
replaced spark plug NGK UR4 and wires (10mm)
replaced fuel filter
removed all fuel injectors and professional cleaned
repaired several vacuum leaks
replaced Idle Air Control Valve
replaced Throttle body vacuum block
installed RJC power plate and replaced all throttle body gaskets
replaced original MAF with 3" GM MAF, added translator
replaced front upper/lower ball joints
replaced front/rear coil springs
replaced front/rear bushings
These are some of the replacement I have done over the years of owning for 33 years ago
I don't race or beat the car, and yet I don't baby it either
The reason why I removed the intake manifold is I have replaced just about all upper gasket except the intake, and I felt before removal the intake ports might be dirty or water passageway might be a little clog. The car temperature has been running around 173 to 187* scanmaster ATS is 143 while in the summer hours in SC is about 90+.
I glad I removed the intake as you can see the water passageway is started to clogged.
I wiped the intake gasket as some few drop of water felt onto the gasket while removing the intake manifold, but my personal feeling the intake and the vale springs area is pretty clean.
Both radiator sections was boiled, repaired, and top cap was resolder about 15 years ago. Right now I'm using small amount of blended antifreeze, with distilled water and RMI-25 Coolant Additive. prior to this I was using full antifreeze while living in NY.
Drove the car down the block almost every month and ran real strong, and for years no smoke, and no oil leaks.
Yea I know all TR leaks oil.
Believe me my GN don't leak no oil, the garage floor is always dry
replaced Rear end seal
replaced timing chain with Cloyes single chain
replaced valve cover using Victor gasket
Steve, I'm also going to order the locks (648-12) to match the valve springs and retainers
there are two types of locks:

https://www.compcams.com/12-pairs-steel-street-locks-1-groove-7-176-angle-11-32-stem-size.html - 601-12
https://www.compcams.com/12-pairs-machined-steel-race-locks-1-groove-7-176-angle-11-32-stem-size.html - 648-12
Please look at these and let me know what you think.
Also, can I just remove the 3 bolts that hold the rocker arms without removing the white buttons?
Thanks
 

[Steve Wood]

No need to touch the white nylon plugs.  Just pull the three bolts

Either set of locks will work as you are not running a high pressure spring.  Only three bucks or so difference in them.

[gnonyx]

No need to touch the white nylon plugs.  Just pull the three bolts

Either set of locks will work as you are not running a high pressure spring.  Only three bucks or so difference in them.

Thank You Steve for all of your help
Once I get the valves springs, retainers, and locks, and start to install them I will post again; if I don't run in trouble
Have a nice weekend, Julio

[xracerx13]

To whom ever reads this in the future:

The Comp 981's without shims @ 1.727 end up being around 92-95psi seat.
They (Comp cams)state that at 1.7 the 981's are 105psi.
You don't want to shim these to 1.7 for a stock cam or you'll be in the 100-105psi seat area and I think that's a little much for the stock flat tappet cam.
Unless your gonna run super high boost on your new roller cam with ported heads, etc., then and only then should you use the 0.030" shims on 981's. Again just my opinion.

The 980's with .030 shims brings them to 1.697 and around 88-90lbs. Pretty darn close to 1.700
That's 1.727 - .030" shims = 1.697" seat height.
They (Comp cams)state that at 1.7 the 980's are 92psi.
Now if you put in 980's without shims (@1.727)then you will be Screwed down to like 78psi. Worse than stock especially after break in it would end up being less.

Don't make the same mistake probably 1000's of people have made by following the idiotic youtube video that says to just put in the 980's without shims. I can't believe that's even still up on youtube.

Either way ...980 shimmed with .030's or 981 without shims it will be a seat of the pants difference.
Steve is right that the 981's alone without shims are fine.
I just went the 980 route to keep at or below 90psi.

I did not replace the valve locks and retainers . The factory locks and retainers are the 7 Degree type.

Now in regards to the valve rocker retainer buttons, I replaced mine while I was in there. I did notice quite a few had become brittle as they were removed. They are like a $1 a piece so why not do it.

For the valve seals I just used the Felpro ones.

As far as valve cover gaskets I went with Jason's gaskets at RJC racing. They are really thick, less prone to leaking, and can be removed and reused no problem.

Obviously sand blasted the valve covers and repainted them.  They were painted with Cast aluminum in a spray can and they came out great.

[Steve Wood]

the spring rate for the 981's calculated to be 95 psi at 1.727 when I checked it the other day.  I suspect they will quickly drop down a bit more.

[xracerx13]

that's why I put 92-95 :-)