60 ft blues

[wmsonta]

So..
4700 stall @ 22# boost,
prob 3300 stall @ 15#.
I would guess it does really well @ light throttle/no or little boost on the street. Probably moves the car right along @ 2000-2500 rpm.

I have to admit, I am curious where you go from here. I think the smart money is on trying to go a little faster.

[Steve Wood]

Tim, I harp on turning stuff off trying to simplify things and squeeze out things that don't make sense.


Technology is not always trustworthy.  I spent months trying to get William's car to run like we thought it should.  No matter what we did, it kept adding fuel (same chip as you)  When I looked at the narrow band numbers, the car did not look lean to me.


Eric messed with the chip, William changed all kinds of things, car did not run differently.  Finally, I told him to put a new wb sensor in the car and try that.  The car picked up four tenths running on the chip defaults.  I am pretty sure that he put a few gallons of race gas in it and the sensor went out of calibration.


I always compare the nb numbers to the wb numbers to see if they seem to agree.


I saw another car that was running about 10.6 and the wb and narrow band were not in agreement.  His tuner said it was fine.  I said something is wrong.  He put his fp gauge on the windshield and he was running on alky the last part of the race because the fuel pressure went away.


I drove my GN Friday to get it inspected.  I had not driven it for several months.  I noticed the wb said it was idling at 14.5 when it normally was set around 12 and that looked wrong but it idled nice and fine.  I was cruising down the road at 75 and the wb said (via my scanmaster) that it was running at 17.8.  I looked at the nb and it was varying between 000 to 040 which is normal cruise which is usually close to 15.  I opened my glovebox where my NGK controller is stashed and it was reading 14.7 which was normal. 


Now, why is the SM via PL reporting 17.8 and controller saying 14.7.  I don't have a clue but it is not the first time I have seen such.  I went thru the SM screens to EGT and it said it was idling at 1825 degs...and that ain't right either.


I am not going to be surprised when  I connect my laptop that PL is reading one thing and the SM is reporting something else.  Bob told me that could not happen but I have seen it on my other car read vacuum at one thing on the SM, another thing, on PL and the PL agreed closely with the boost gauge. 


I have a thing about dumbing it down to try to verify things because I have seen so many things that don't look right and some times things are not what they seem to be and we have to go back to basics and work our way forward.


Too much data and too many variables are not always a good thing.  Therefore, Stone Age it now and then 

[Tim Hensley]

So..
4700 stall @ 22# boost,
prob 3300 stall @ 15#.
I would guess it does really well @ light throttle/no or little boost on the street. Probably moves the car right along @ 2000-2500 rpm.

I have to admit, I am curious where you go from here. I think the smart money is on trying to go a little faster.

You have described the car to purification. Faster was the purpose but I’m looking for my false KR today.


[size=78%]My 02 volts go .913start of the run to 799 most every pass.[/size]
I see both wb and nb # I don’t know what I’m looking at but nb are good numbers rich for sure.wb too
Plugs showed that last night, even with the RJC plat front is richer than back no surprise, can’t guess what it would look like without it.got 6k miles on them,put a new set of NGKs closed the gap just a bit to .035 even though I have no spark problem at .040.


Wide band has never seen race gas or octane boost. I log fuel and Alky both track as they should my fuel as always been a little behind but I think it’s the offset number but it close.


Passenger side header is close to the upper A arm bushings heat shield, don’t remember it being that close and RJC rear motor brace being adjusted that fare,I’ll be looking at the engine mount this week

[wmsonta]

 looking for my false KR today.

Bye all means. Here is where I defer to people who have experience w/turbo Buicks. I nave none. I fear it enough, I installed an audible alarm in a completely original gn.

I do have some experience with both kinds of O2 sensors. Narrow and wideband. They are used to tune carb's. Most applications are exclusively race gas. In my world, if you wonder about the output, you change the sensor first. This should not be taken as advise. There are people here who were dealing with these issues over 10 yrs ago.

Good luck.

[Grumpy]

Too much data and too many variables are not always a good thing.  Therefore, Stone Age it now and then 

Very True . Some forget the basics. Easy to do really.
I'd fix the knock issue first.
 

[gusszgs]

Too much data and too many variables are not always a good thing.  Therefore, Stone Age it now and then 

Very True . Some forget the basics. Easy to do really.
I'd fix the knock issue first.
 

lol....my best run ever was going via stone age. Just focused on the SM and boost........p oint n shoot

[Steve Wood]

I'm wondering if the two step builds a lot of heat, fast, in the combustion chamber?  Normally, we add timing in low gear to get the turbo to spool-particularly if the converter is a bit tight.


I'm wondering it would run quicker if we did not add extra timing?

[Grumpy]

I'm wondering it would run quicker if we did not add extra timing?

We do a lot of track rentals to "try" our new idea's. Some work some didn't. It's all a learning curve. 

[Steve Wood]

you don't know until you try

[Steve Wood]

Tim, you ever try launching that thing by shocking the converter?  In other words, bring it up to 6-7 psi against the brake and then hammering it when the light changes?  Sometimes that will give more torque multiplication than bringing it up to close to full stall against the brake...let's it flash stall even higher

that's a case where more timing may work better

[Tim Hensley]

No I haven’t. Like Grumpy said some stuff works and some doesn’t. And what I’m doing is not working  so well. Some of its better passes have been around 15, no more constant passes.
I’m almost positive I have a broken motor mount,won’t have time tell this weekend to address. I did order a mount from RJC and talked about the proper way to adjust his motor brace   
Thanks for input
I have a punch list started.
1 check tire pressure and contact patch
2 set chip timing to default and go back to the basics
3 start at lower boost and rpm
One I can make two or three good clean passes,sit in my chair and make one change at a time

[reality]

Just a couple things that did not  work for me.
1 tying the motor down solid. Limited movement seemed to work better in 60 ft.
2 The ATR rear bar would keep the rear suspension from working at all and spin the tires. Plus it made the car drive like a buckboard. JMO.

[Grumpy]

Just a couple things that did not  work for me.

2 The ATR rear bar would keep the rear suspension from working at all and spin the tires. Plus it made the car drive like a buckboard. JMO.

Yup... works for some an not for others. We have used it on a lot of cars with good results. Used it all the way into the high 9s.

[Grumpy]

Broken MM you can leave the hood open an power brake the car. You can see if it's doin the watusi looking threw by the bottom of the hood.  Hows the trans mount ??

[Steve Wood]

  that's the easiest way I know