GN Won't Start

[Wayner]

  Hello everyone. I am new to IHADAV8 and hoping for some help. I drove the car for a few days in a row and then I went to start it in the morning and not even a kick.

I have no spark and I used a noid light to figure out I have no injector pulse.

I have fuel pressure and can hear the pump running.

I have checked all my fuses (CCCI, ign etc.) even replaced them with known good ones just to be sure.

I have checked the orange wire going from the battery to FAST system and all is good.

I have replaced (and tested) the crank sensor. I have rotated the crank by hand while using a multi meter and have sensor voltage when the ring passes the hull.

I have replaced the ignition module and coil pack with one that I had. I have also borrowed one off of my friends GN which works great on his.

I have checked all the grounds and also used multiple jumpers to add grounds just to be sure.

The only thing is that I don't have is an engine service light. With the classic FAST system will you have that on? I don't ever remember seeing it on. When my cam sensor failed I noticed I didn't have the service engine light on. Once I changed the cam sensor I don't remember if the light came on or not?

Anything I am missing?

Thoughts...

Thanks!!!!

[Scoobum]

No spark...no injector pulse. Hope I have this right. Crank sensor to ignition module to ECM. I'd swap one at a time in that order. You have FAST instead of the ECM...so we'll likely need one of the guys experienced with that.

I'd be checking to make sure the ignition module is getting power. If all these checks didn't work...then I'd consult Steves no start tree. Takes time with the checks...but you'll eventually nail it down.

[Scoobum]

Think Earl said awhile back there were two different crank sensors...or two different crank sensor mounts. Be sure the one you swapped in is the same.

[TexasT]

Welcome to the site!

Not a fast guy either, but with any internal combustion engine, we need fuel(you say you have it), compression(we think you have it) and spark at the correct time.

I'm guessing it is turning over. What do you have for the timing set? I hope it isn't a stock nylon top gear. Could have jumped time( maybe pull a vc and see if the valves are opening and closing).
With no spark I think the Steve no start tree is where I would go. I'm guessing you have checked your fuses and they are all good. First one id look at is the ign one.

Let us know how you do.

[Scoobum]

One other thing...remove the cam sensor cap...and see if the cam sensor is spinning. You're in Toronto...Norb s will know about the SES light in regards to FAST. Dave...JUSTASI X?? here will have his number.

[Just a Six?]

Glad you made it over here because you will definitely find lots of help & we will get you going. My 1st guess was the Cam Sensor sheared the pin so the top is loose. He's going to pop off the cap & have a peek. It's a start but mine did that while the engine was running & not sitting there parked? 

[Steve Wood]

I am not FAST experienced so I am not sure on the check engine light.  I guess that is a question for Norbs or someone that has FAST.  Normally, if it does not come on when the key is turned to on,  you would start here  http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/No_SES_chart_1.htm...but FAST?  I have no clue

[earlbrown]

Think Earl said awhile back there were two different crank sensors...or two different crank sensor mounts. Be sure the one you swapped in is the same.

Both.  If they bolt up, they match.   The crank sensors you can buy now won't fit on a bracket that came on the cars new.  It's been enough decades now that I'm sure it's the new styles on anything but a 20 mile barn find.


As far as FAST systems, i don't know shit about them.   I'd like to think there's some sort of diagnostic output either a light or a computer hookup or something.


Here's on test that's quick and easy though....   pop of the oil fill, spin the engine and see if the rockers move....

[SuperSix]

I am not FAST experienced so I am not sure on the check engine light.  I guess that is a question for Norbs or someone that has FAST.  Normally, if it does not come on when the key is turned to on,  you would start here  http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/No_SES_chart_1.htm...but FAST?  I have no clue

That's a very nice thing to say, and yet another reason I want to provide this platform.

[good2win22]

Just a thought...  You said you replaced the cam sensor... Timing on the cam sensor? Is the connector on the cam sensor seated properly?

[SuperSix]

And WELCOME to IHADAV8.com, Wayner!

[Wayner]

  Wow!! Thanks for the welcome and all the good ideas!

I replaced the cam sensor about 6 months ago and it has been driving great. I will take the cap off and see if it spins.  I just replaced a valve spring on the drivers side and need to replace the gasket. I will verify cam timing and valve timing when the cover is off. The engine was rebuilt in 2008 and not sure of the timing set that it is in it.

There is a laptop connection for the FAST system so I might have to dust off the old laptop running XP and see what it has to say. It has 3 lights on the Caspers adaptor indicating 12V, sensor and standby. All 3 light up when I start cranking


Thanks again everyone for the help!! 

[aminga]

No spark...no injector pulse. Hope I have this right. Crank sensor to ignition module to ECM. I'd swap one at a time in that order. You have FAST instead of the ECM...so we'll likely need one of the guys experienced with that.

I'd be checking to make sure the ignition module is getting power. If all these checks didn't work...then I'd consult Steves no start tree. Takes time with the checks...but you'll eventually nail it down.

Here'e the guide

No start - no spark, has injector pulse - Check the ignition module (also check the CCCI and ECM-IGN fuses)
No start - has spark, no injector pulse - Cam Sensor or ECM
No start - no spark or injector pulse - Crank sensor or module


The logic behind this is During iniital cranking the IGN module fires the plug so it's the driver for the plugs.   Once the ENgine goes over 400 RPM it goes into bypass and the ECM controls timing.   The Crank sensor is the critical timing interface.

[Scoobum]

Thanks...and happy birthday!

[Wayner]

Hello everyone!

Update: I checked the cam sensor and it is timed correctly and spinning when I turn the crank. Also, checked the and valve timing is correct.

I have been pretty busy camping with the family but will work on the SES light tree next!

My old crank sensor was the old style and the new one is the new style. Will that affect anything? The mount is the same from what I can tell

Thanks!!