Wide band for street use/tuning?

[tb3]

makes sense to me then!   
We need to control each injector seperatly, and have a wide band on each cylinder exhaust port, to get the most out of a wide band?

[Steve Wood]

No....not unless you are a millionaire engine building/tuning company

[daveismissing]

I wonder how bad these  are - look how cheap the sensor/integrated controller is:
http://14point7.com/

I still think the AFX is the best choice but if one is going the cheap route...

[Scoobum]

makes sense to me then!   
We need to control each injector seperatly, and have a wide band on each cylinder exhaust port, to get the most out of a wide band?

You`ve been hanging out with Norbs.

[Steve Wood]

I think he has been reading too many ads and listening to all the guys that don't know anything about tuning posting that you need one to tune....

IF, you have a chip that can be driven closed loop by a wb, then you might be able to justify having one, but, if you have a street car, don't bet on going any faster.  Also, it only sets the a/f to what you typed in and does not give you the flexibility to vary a/f versus rpm and load.  AND, you still have to determine what is the optimum a/f....and how do you do that?

Just like with a factory narrow band...lean as possible without detonation plus a desired  safety factor.

I think some have been led to believe that there is something magical about a wb and they do not have to know how to tune because it does it for them or they think because Joe runs 10.6-1 and he goes high nines...that is the number they should dial in to run 11.8 times.

I use the SD chips which can be driven by a wb, but after twice having the wb stop working when I was wot, I decided to set the car up and then go open loop so I did not go from a 10.8 to a  14.7 in the blink of my eye.

Then we complicate things by having an alky set up...alky affects the a/f so if you spray twice as much alky with your dual nozzle set up as your buddy with a single nozzle set up, and set your a/f's the same because you believe in magic numbers one of you may have an awakening.  Straight methanol may make the most power at an a/f of 4.2 whereas straight gas may make the most power at 10.6 in blown situations.  So what is the magic number if you are spraying a mix?  (there is something to be said for using lambda)

You still have to tune the car!

[Charlief1]

Like Steve's saying, a wb really won't help unless you are really pushing the limits of the car. In my case I need 1 because it's a carbed car. I don't have the same control over the tune like an SFI car has and have to physically change jets, hangers, and needles to change the tune. There is also a new controller from J&S electronics that will allow for better control of boost and timing rather than rely on the original system. I found out about just recently and have looked at it seriously. It's similar to a 2 step that some are using but it's for a boosted carb application.   Full control of timing per lb of boost and individual timing retard for each cylinder along with a knock count for each cylinder so you know which cylinder is getting the lowest advance or retard on the timing.

[Steve Wood]

yep, wb's are great for carbed car tuning...Some of the modern cars make it a lot easier with the screw in bleeds and jets.

[tb3]

makes sense to me then.
Let me just say I have put the wide band on 2 of my cars in the past.  My logic was that being that since the stock O2 sensor is not very accurate for anything other than 14.7:1 afr, ... The wide band makes it alot easier to see where I need to "fill in the gaps", like you mentioned earlier.
I have considered it more or less, a good tuning tool for dummies (something I do qualify for  )
but I am realising the points you make, Steve.  I have very modest and attainable goals for my 87.  I'm gonna have questions when I install alky, turbo and converter on this one
 
 

[motorhead]

Just saw this come up in my spammed email from Amazon.  Looks really cool:

http://www.plxdevices.com/Wideband-O2-Touch-Screen-Multi-Guage-p/897346002719.htm

Especially for $188.  I might buy one to try if the Buick sells this weekend because the LC-1 in the car will be gone.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00U1J1MCK?redirect=true&ref_=pe_344980_169888390_em_1p_14_ti

[Steve Wood]

that's pretty slick!  Price is certainly more affordable these days for what you get

[larrym]

nice find Mike that's very cool

[Forzfed]

Just saw this come up in my spammed email from Amazon.  Looks really cool:

http://www.plxdevices.com/Wideband-O2-Touch-Screen-Multi-Guage-p/897346002719.htm

Especially for $188.  I might buy one to try if the Buick sells this weekend because the LC-1 in the car will be gone.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00U1J1MCK?redirect=true&ref_=pe_344980_169888390_em_1p_14_ti

Good price.  I paid $230 for my AFX with the NTK sensor, which I thought was a smoking good deal at the time.  They sure have gone up now!

[daveismissing]

What does it spew out the serial port(s)?

[nocooler]

Widebands are nice they provide data - but it's what you do with the data that makes the difference.

[daveismissing]

I guess the Ballenger Motorsports AFR500 equivalent of the AFX is $350 USD w NKT sensor
http://www.bmotorsports.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/2337