one more over-rated question

[tb3]

I think this is the last one, ok probably not, knowing me 
I don't know why I'm on this kick.  Probably because since I've accepted work on my buicks is only gonna get done when it gets done, and not on a time schedule,...I have more time to look at stuff and question it, lol!
 
I'm wondering about the true effectiveness of the 2 front frame braces some vendors sell.  Their also the ones that came factory on some or all Monte Carlos.
I know the C channel in the middle of our cars is weak and flexes, I get that, but on the front and rear where its boxed and you have those monstrositys joing them together like the engine cradle, is there really any flex there? 
From the center of the cradle to where each brace bolts to each horn, I don't see how theres gonna be any flex, for no more length that is?
Since gm installed them factory on the Montes, I'm going to assume I'm wrong 

[$1987 GN$]

Take the body off and you will see how flimsy the frame really is. Any bracing helps.

AJ___

[Steve Wood]

I think you are wrong as my experience was a tighter front end when going down a bumpy street.   Don't get excited, Earl.

The triangulation works even better with a cross brace at the front.  Unfortunately this stuff gets difficult when other than stock intercoolers

[motorhead]

I think you are wrong as my experience was a tighter front end when going down a bumpy street.   Don't get excited, Earl.

The triangulation works even better with a cross brace at the front.  Unfortunately this stuff gets difficult when other than stock intercoolers

I agree with points 1 & 2, but disagree with #3 because  I've got the MCSS and GP bars on my Buick with a FMIC.  I think large SLICs are the real issue.

[1KWIKSIX]

I've got Kirbans (3pc) braces that triangulate the front end mounted on my car with Precisions SLIC & it fits . I must be lucky cause I know many have had issues with the clearances & had to modify the triangular brace or add a plate to the bottom brace mounting point directly under the engine to get these to fit.

In addition to the under hood fender to Rad support braces & rear seat brace.....I've installed Kirbans repro rubber body bushings and I must say that all the above = a tighter ride with less body roll & less frame flex.  The ride feels like a new car again!


The Bilstein shocks & 16" Goodrich GForce Sport Tires probably help a bit too.



HR PartsNstuff rear sway bar is going on in the spring with some new front control arms: G Body Tubular Upper control arms & UMI tubular lowers with Delrin Bushings...... will be interesting to note if there is much change in the ride (good / bad / or otherwise).

[tb3]

ok, I'm not arguing with anybody, but here me out with this, lol!
besides, its cold and weather sucks outside (for some of us anyways).
again, I do get the point you get twist and bend from the C-channel, but if the boxed frame up front and in the rear itself is going to twist, isn't that going to do some serious damage? 
I took a pic of my 84 gn which is somewhat apart at the moment, but has the braces installed.  notice how both points where they bolt to the frame is in front of the engine cradle, and, ahead of the center of axis of the front axles.  It looks like it would be impossible to have any left to right, or front to back flex there.
I've read about all the tri angle of braces and such and how it tightens up the front end, especially with t tops and such,  but could it be a matter of helping prevent vibration, vs flex?     and I say that half joking and half serious
oh well, no method to my madness really, just making conversation and trying to figure out how there could be any flexing from point a to point b, lol!     
 
 
 
 

[motorhead]

Think about the load on the suspension and how that is translated to the frame.  The open channel in the frame is only an issue when you are dealing with some severe changes in pitch and roll from corner to corner (ie. pulling the front wheel).

There is a lot of stability and predicability to be gained from reinforcing the chassis at various pick-up points. Especially when the cars are rubber bushed and have a lot of slop built into them.

Just installing an axle-to-frame mounted swaybar is enough to straighten out the launch of a g-body, removing the twist we all know and love (to crack our A-pillars).  The same can be accounted for on the other end of the car...

[$1987 GN$]

[tb3]

I do see your point about picking up points to increase the frames stability, but still.. looking at where those front frame braces bolt to, I don't see how their going to do anything to prevent twist when I don't see how the frame is going to twist there anyway.
never theless, those front frame braces are going to stay 
god forbid I ever have a front-end collision I would hope the extra strength on those horns would prevent them from bending and make the bumper take the bend.
hey motorhead, this may be old news to you, not sure, but in case it isn't, have you ever seen these aftermarket g body full frames?  pics are halfway down the page.  You can order with several differant options.
pretty stellar 
http://schwartzperformance.com/1978-1988-g-body-monte-carlo-chassis/
 

[motorhead]

Hmmm... I didn't realize they actually went into production.

[Top Speed]

I like that, but there is no way I am putting a dime more into my fucking car!

[jason]

I just ordered a set of these rear triangulation braces for the TR and Roadmaster Wagon because they had a GP going on.

Maybe one day I'll get around to installing the SC&C GN Chassis brace if I can get to spend some time at home.

[TURBOPOWERED68]

The supports that never get mentioned are the ones from the cross member to the frame by the #2 body bushing. Why?

[tb3]

I just ordered a set of these rear triangulation braces for the TR and Roadmaster Wagon because they had a GP going on.

Maybe one day I'll get around to installing the SC&C GN Chassis brace if I can get to spend some time at home.

very interesting!
can you post a picture of the rears once you get them installed?

[jason]

here's what they look like installed on a B-body.  It should give you a pretty good idea.